Interview with M. Gayle “Asali” Dickson, M.Div.
By Wanda Sabir
M. Gayle Dickson a.k.a “Asali” says, “There were five of us who worked on the newspaper. Between 1972-1974, I was the only female artist published in the Black Panther Party newspaper. We worked together as a team and talked over ideas to come up with what to put in the newspaper. Emory taught us how to integrate politics into the artwork. Our art was informed by the 10-Point Platform Program.” Ms. Dickson is one of artists profiled in the Oakland Museum exhibition: All Power to the People: Black Panthers at 50, October 8-February 12, in the Museum’s Great Hall.
When one thinks about the power of art, especially figurative art which evokes the spirit of the people, public art featuring the faces of the disappeared, ignored or forgotten, like that found in Chicago’s Wall of Respect or on the pages of Muhammad Speaks and of course the Black Panther paper, come to mind. On these pages we see a people a beautiful people. If nowhere else, here is a place where black is beautiful all the time in all its shapes, ages, sizes and forms. Perhaps this was the appeal of Marcus Garvey’s Negro World, a publication that traveled the African Diaspora—the first global soul train.
I caught up with the artist by phone last weekend for a conversation about art and memory, legacy and spirituality. If you look at images on the back page weekly, we see a battlefield, urban warfare, black people hunted like wild game.
Coming of Age in the ‘60s
MGAD: “I came of age in the 1960s. It was the best of times and the worst of times. I was partying and wearing miniskirts with Gogo boots. Seemed like everyone was wearing Naturals. There was a sense of community in the air. We greeted each other with ‘how you doing brother,’ ‘how you doing sister.’ I took art classes at Merritt Community College from Mr. Claude Clark where I learned about African heritage. The study of African masks and other artifacts helped me appreciate my ancestry. That was the best of times, but it was also the worst of times, because between 1963 to 1969 there were 18 assassinations that I’m aware of. I call them assassinations because they were treacherous and premeditated.
1963 Medgar Evers, 16th Street Bombing – 4 Little Girls; President Kennedy, Assassinated
1964 Four Civil Rights Workers Assassinated
1965 Malcolm X, Viola Liuzzo Assassinated
1967 Denzell Dowell assassinated in Richmond, CA
1968 Martin King and Lil’ Bobby Hutton assassinated; Robert Kennedy, Assassinated.
1969 Alprentice “Bunchy” Carter, John Huggins (Los Angeles) and Fred Hampton (Chicago) Assassinated.”
She then speaks of an iconic photograph of herself at a protest at Housewives Market on Ninth Street in Oakland.
MGAD: “I call it, ‘the me I almost forgot.’ After I move to Richmond, while unpacking I discover a photo of myself boycotting something. I am amazed that it’s managed to stay with me all this time.
“It was May 1968. I am still 19 years old until June of that same year. The sign I am holding reads: ‘Don’t Shop Here; Stop By and Ask.’ There is a lady standing next to me. She is holding two signs that read: ‘Dignity or Bargains, Take Your Choice,’ and ‘Please Don’t Cross The Line And Step On Our Freedom.’ The only place I remember being boycotted from back in that day was Housewives Market.
Gayle says that even though she thinks she knows the reason why she was there, the public protest must have been covered by the local paper so she does an Internet search.
MGAD: “I look up “Boycott Housewives Market,” add, “1967” guessing by the age I appeared in the photo; then, add, “Oakland, CA.” I even put in Swans Department Store, which was connected to Housewives Market in some mysterious way for me. All that come up were these wonderful articles talking about the prosperous period in Oakland’s history when Swan’s Department Store and Housewives Market were a busy section of downtown Oakland. [Then] suddenly, the articles stop around the late 1950s and early 1960s, then pick up again around the 1990s when downtown Oakland is in the process of rebuilding these two historical sites; and all the money involved; and who were the investors; and what a glorious history these two stores have; and all the new restaurants located inside the market now; the meat market and how good it is doing financially now; and how that area is picking up.
“Wait a minute! What happened between the decline and the ascent? According to these articles, my time in history does not exist. Vanished off the face of the earth! Erased! You think maybe I wasn’t boycotting Housewives Market? But that is the only boycott in my memory bank! Am I remembering something that never existed? What! I don’t exist? Have I been erased from history? This is disturbing. Can I possibly be that insignificant?”
When Gayle refines her search and looks at the Oakland Tribune archives, there she finds what she is looking for. Keyword searches work best when one is in the right database.
MGAD: “I resume my research with and enter, “Boycott of Housewives Market + Oakland Tribune Newspaper.” Bing-o! What I found, was the boycott was a protest for more community control of the police by West Oakland’s black community. The protest was called by an ad hoc group called Blacks for Justice Committee.
This information ground Gayle in the knowledge that despite attempts to bury the past, the photo validates the incident and its participants. In George Orwell’s novel, “1984,” there is a ministry that erases the past if it challenges the state. The protagonist Winston works at the Ministry of Truth, where documents are altered or destroyed which contradict or challenge Big Brother. He gets into trouble when he secretly tries to remember vanishing truths. In Oceania, Gayle’s photo would have been destroyed and with it her memories. Memories are not encouraged in a totalitarian society.
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“The trip for me is, if I had not mysteriously stumbled onto this photograph, this part of my history would have been lost, and vanished from my memory. Yet, this memory has significance as I look back like the Sankofa bird, in search of my past, so that I may move forward. I am a part of recorded history; I am not erased. The spirit that I had in joining the Black Panther Party can find roots in that Boycott.”
WS: Wow. What context.
In the exhibit at the OM you have art which reflects the issues you were protesting then. One drawing looks at the rising cost of living while wages stay the same, “All out War Declared in Middle East (1973) is topical, as do “Vote for survival” (1972), and “Let it Shine, Let it Shine, Let it Shine!” (1972).
In the OM store patrons can purchase the Asali collection which includes art not exhibited: A guy with his hand on his hip, a garbage can next to him entitled: “Any Town USA” and “The Prices Are Going Up, but My Pay Check Isn’t” (1973). From the police violence to economic deprivation to war to hunger, these drawings are just as relevant today.
MGAD: “An image is worth a thousand words.”
Yes, an iconic photograph says a lot about this revolutionary woman, her drawings, her ministry and the lives she has touched through her artistry and as a teacher in the Oakland Community School, and later as a minister and advocate for elders and other vulnerable populations— her legacy is a daily reminder.
At the press preview reception at the OMCA, All Power to the People: Black Panthers at 50, she met a photographer from San Francisco who told her how his dad would take him to Glide Memorial for the Free Breakfast Program. I hadn’t known this about Rev. Cecil Williams’s church, but I am not surprised. San Francisco was central to the BPP. It published its newspaper in the City. There is an exhibit there presently, curated by Billy X, at the African American Art and Culture Complex, 762 Fulton Street which looks at this history.
Gayle says her family supported the Black Panther Party as the artist shares how she and her mother would be in the house listening surreptitiously to Malcolm X Speaks on a record player. “She is probably the reason I was at Housewives [that day].”
WS: You have lived a very full life. The Black Panther Party at 50—what a milestone for an organization which still resonates so powerfully in communities worldwide. You are a mother and a grandmother, you have worked and continue to work with youth. How does this generation push forward, taking the lessons of movements like the BPP in stride as they look to build a stronger movement going forward– like the Black Lives Matter Movement and other Social Justice Movements?
MGAD: “I have heard this question before. The Rev. Martin Luther King said the arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends toward justice. May the next generation pick up the torch of justice, passed on by the Black Panther Party and continue the journey. May they have courage, be in community and be creative.
Ashay!
Events where you can meet and hear this remarkable woman:
M. Gayle “Asali” Dickson will be in conversation with other Black Panther Party Women: Ericka Huggins, Katherine Campbell, Joan Tarika Lewis & Carol Rucker, Monday, October 17, 7 p.m., $7, at the Omi Gallery at Impact Hub Oakland, 2323 Broadway.
Sunday, October 16, 11 a.m. at Church by the Side of the Road, Rev. Dickson will deliver the sermon on the story of Tamar, entitled, “When We Make Sour Lemon Choices, God Makes Divine Lemonade.” The church is located at 2108 Russell St, Berkeley, (510) 644-1263. This will be her last sermon. After this her palate will be her pulpit.
At the 50th Anniversary conference:
Saturday, October 22, 11-1 LIBERATION THEOLOGY—THE BLACK PANTHER PARTY & THE CHURCH
Sankofa, Looking Back to Go Forward Presenters:
Rev. M. Gayle (Asali) Dickson
Former Panther, Sycamore Community Church
Pastor Michael McBride, The Way Christian Center
Rev. Kamal Hassan, Sojourner Truth Presbyterian Church
Rev. Dr. Martha C. Taylor, Allen Temple Baptist Church